tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6534665086749553287.post3788928985264863296..comments2024-03-27T08:53:29.267-04:00Comments on CURMUDGUCATION: Whitney Tilson Is Better Than YouPeter Greenehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16511193640285760299noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6534665086749553287.post-64128448136084229282023-08-22T20:25:57.341-04:002023-08-22T20:25:57.341-04:00You just proved the Curmudgeon's point! Tilson...You just proved the Curmudgeon's point! Tilson knowledge domain is investment finance. He knows nothing about education.Ellie Kesselmanhttps://ellieaskswhy.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6534665086749553287.post-72987938001838014592015-03-22T14:10:53.061-04:002015-03-22T14:10:53.061-04:00Great piece. Highly recommended to anyone reading ...Great piece. Highly recommended to anyone reading through the comments here.Peter Greenehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16511193640285760299noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6534665086749553287.post-72941099555062802472015-03-22T11:42:26.614-04:002015-03-22T11:42:26.614-04:00My 2009 take on Whitney Tilson. http://perimeterpr...My 2009 take on Whitney Tilson. http://perimeterprimate.blogspot.com/2009/04/disadvantages-of-elite-education.htmlThe Perimeter Primatehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12619173438763495716noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6534665086749553287.post-51561385688911861002015-03-22T09:56:45.266-04:002015-03-22T09:56:45.266-04:00Well said. Market based morals lead to some intere...Well said. Market based morals lead to some interesting conclusions about how to organize and manage certain fundamental human services. Peter Greenehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16511193640285760299noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6534665086749553287.post-5248188149496134612015-03-22T09:28:33.983-04:002015-03-22T09:28:33.983-04:00Rambling thoughts on what else is wrong (or even &...Rambling thoughts on what else is wrong (or even "not even wrong") with Tilson's comments:<br /><br />1. Maybe Tilson sees himself as wholly philanthropic in the sense that he won't get appreciably richer on this but his funds and investors will if he utilizes the tools we've learned about. And more importantly: he is the classic case of seeing everything as a nail. He may not desire more money, but he is quite vested in the notion that when the market makes people money that means it is working not only efficiently but morally, and that is a dangerous trap in public education. Tilson is used to looking and evaluating things based on metrics like price/earnings ratios, but in education, very often you HAVE to spend more, a LOT more, to get less because of the challenges of the populations you are working with. He gets all caught up in measurable outcomes for charters without bothering to look at fundamentals to see how they are like Enron.<br /><br />So Tilson may be right that zip codes should not have such influence on educational outcomes but he doesn't want to get remotely close to what would actually address it: breaking down income segregation with a renewed commitment to mixed income housing development and a massive influx of resources into schools with high poverty populations because educating a child is not like producing consumer electronics.<br /><br />2. His nasty tripe about it being all about the "adults" and the politicians who kowtow, as if the majority of teachers are moochers on the public dime. Look, buster, there are 3 million teachers out there. Do you think it is possible to run any system of employment for that many people and have no aspect of it be about the people busting their humps? Do you look at hospitals and see nothing but a system that is all about the health care providers?<br /><br />All of these complaints about teachers and unions come down to a fundamental belief that no employee anywhere should be secure in a job -- that the market is the only force capable of determining the value of labor and that fear of job loss keeps workers productive. It never occurs to someone like Tilson that the best teachers HAVE to be able to be adversarial with management in a way that would get them fired from Tilson's kind of operation. But we all know that in order to be good at this you need the ability to push back on boneheaded ideas that originate far outside of your specific context and you need considerable autonomy.<br /><br />3. Teacher Quality: Bullshit. There is not one indicator that he can point to that shows we have a drastic decline in teacher quality. Not one. Requirements and gate keeping have gone up in every decade since the 1970s, and his markers are not actual indicators of who is or is not going to be a great teacher or even a good teacher. He is again obsessed with numeric markers that would mean college professors would enjoy reputations as the best teachers around. Right.<br /><br />School quality as measured by progress in NAEP has been fairly constant and rising just a bit since initial big gains when we were actively integrating schools. Looking at the negative trends of income segregation and rising inequality, the fact that NAEP measures have been fairly constant is no indication of any slump in teacher quality -- in fact, teacher quality is probably better considering we've held ground under much worse conditions than previous decades.<br /><br />Nor is it remotely true that we need many more college graduates -- unless your goal is to deflate the value of a college degree so that college educated workers are cheap to hire and easy to replace. College wages are flat -- and the college wage benefit only remains because wages for people without degrees are crashing. If Tilson thinks that we need MORE BAs at this moment in history, then I question whether or not such a titan of finance understands basic labor economics.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6534665086749553287.post-21947372853461877672015-03-21T11:23:14.959-04:002015-03-21T11:23:14.959-04:00Peter, you don't just outnumber and outgun guy...Peter, you don't just outnumber and outgun guys like Tilson, you out-think them. You need to challenge these "thought-leaders" to a Think-Off. My money is on you to win any day.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6534665086749553287.post-11283936044766162842015-03-21T08:57:37.377-04:002015-03-21T08:57:37.377-04:00The concentration of wealth for a tiny elite is th...The concentration of wealth for a tiny elite is the root of the problem. They have unlimited resources to inflict their fantasies of "reform" on the world no matter how misguided and misinformed.Ken Derstinehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02645967327068634236noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6534665086749553287.post-76604178529758938382015-03-21T07:51:50.332-04:002015-03-21T07:51:50.332-04:00Of course, Whitney bills himself as a brilliant an...Of course, Whitney bills himself as a brilliant analyst of the market prior to his work in education "reform"... and cites this as a reason for to be trusted as an expert in the latter. <br /><br />Oh, you don't believe that? Check out Tilson keen grasp of the tech market and his uncanny ability to predict market success:<br /><br />- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - <br />WHITNEY TILSON (2004):<br /><br />"(Some envision) Google with the same market cap of McDonald's (a stock I own)?! HA! I believe that it is virtually certain that Google's stock will be highly disappointing to investors foolish enough to participate in its overhyped offering -- you can hold me to that." <br />- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - <br /><br />Note: Since then (as of 10/18/13) Google has gone on to give its investors over a 1050% return.<br /><br />Here's the article where Tilson said this... still available on the net:<br /><br />http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2004/07/30/the-tech-stock-opportunity.aspx <br /><br />Has anyone actually "held him to" his prediction? Can anyone?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16911854468188214107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6534665086749553287.post-58629127471759538862015-03-21T07:45:39.102-04:002015-03-21T07:45:39.102-04:00If this is not the time to be a teacher in a schoo...If this is not the time to be a teacher in a school, then this is the time to teach the Betters about the worth of The Help. Sometimes, such as this time, the owners must be reminded of the value of the goose that lays the golden eggs.Robin Kuykendallhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06969052933012750691noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6534665086749553287.post-60046545362640374482015-03-21T03:09:41.936-04:002015-03-21T03:09:41.936-04:00I just read on HuffPost that there's a new glo...I just read on HuffPost that there's a new global teaching award. The recipient is a Maine teacher who's been teaching for 42 years and founded a school, The Center for Teaching and Learning. She said she wouldn't encourage young people to be going into teaching now: "Public school teachers are so constrained right now by the Common Core Standards and the tests that are developed to monitor what teachers are doing with them. It's a movement that's turned teachers into technicians, not reflective practitioners."<br /><br />"If you're a creative, smart young person," she continued, "I don't think this is the time to go into teaching." <br /><br />http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/20/nancie-atwell-prize_n_6910948.html Rebecca deCocahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13168718846105012814noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6534665086749553287.post-5701450842769976492015-03-21T01:43:43.999-04:002015-03-21T01:43:43.999-04:00Very insightful. The new feudal system. "Nobl...Very insightful. The new feudal system. "Noblesse oblige."Rebecca deCocahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13168718846105012814noreply@blogger.com